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posted by [personal profile] emperor at 02:42pm on 11/11/2008
Those of you who have visited our house will know that it can get a little cold downstairs, due to a lack of radiators in the back of the house. We have gas central heating, but often need to light one or two of the gas fires to heat e.g. the sitting room.

Recently, we've been noticing that the gas fire in the sitting room has been going out (the one in the back room does too, but that's a more enclosed fire which vents to the outside directly). What seems to happen is that the pilot flame is too small, so doesn't heat the thermostat sufficiently, so the gas supply gets cut off. Turning the boiler on and off noticably affects the size of the pilot flame. I've yet to note the fire going out when the boiler wasn't running.

This morning, I could run the boiler and the fire OK, but it doesn't seem to work so well in the evening. Is this likely to be because there's a faulty gas supply to the house (that can't supply enough pressure to the various appliances), that the fires which go out are maladjusted, that the boiler is maladjusted, that it's just one of those things we'll have to put up with, or that it's something we should reasonably expect to be fixable?

FWIW, we have 3 gas fires (one of which I think has no thermal cut-out), a gas cooker, and a gas combi-boiler.

ETA: in response to a couple of comments, we had a gas safety certificate done when we moved in (March time), and we do have a CO alarm, which isn't complaining. When the fire is on it seems to be burning fine, and it doesn't leak gas when the pilot's gone out.
There are 17 comments on this entry. (Reply.)
 
posted by [identity profile] mister-jack.livejournal.com at 03:15pm on 11/11/2008
IMO, pilot flames going out is cause to call out a gas engineer, pronto.
 
posted by [identity profile] mhoulden.livejournal.com at 03:28pm on 11/11/2008
Get it checked ASAP, especially if it looks like it's not burning cleanly or if you've got a headache or feel sick when it's on. I've known carbon monoxide coming off gas fires, cookers and boilers, and you really don't want to take chances. If you rent it's your landlord's responsibility to get it sorted out and they can be prosecuted if they don't.
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posted by [personal profile] emperor at 03:30pm on 11/11/2008
We've got a CO alarm, which is happy.
hooloovoo_42: (Danny/Matt live here)
posted by [personal profile] hooloovoo_42 at 03:33pm on 11/11/2008
Probably need an engineer. Most likely a problem with the air intake so the gas/air mix isn't right and it won't burn properly.

If you're renting, your landlord should have all the gas appliances serviced every year and provide you with a copy of the proper certificates. This is a legal requirement.
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posted by [personal profile] emperor at 03:36pm on 11/11/2008
We've got the gas safety cert that was done earlier in the year.

It does seem to still burn OK, but when the boiler comes on, the flame in the fire shrinks, like there isn't enough pressure.
 
posted by [identity profile] james-r.livejournal.com at 03:37pm on 11/11/2008
Does flame on any given appliance change size if you change all the other appliances from off to firing at full rate?
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posted by [personal profile] emperor at 03:38pm on 11/11/2008
The flame on the gas fire changes size (shrinks) when I turn the boiler on.
 
posted by [identity profile] james-r.livejournal.com at 03:45pm on 11/11/2008
Check the main supply tap to the house, see if it's fully open?
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posted by [identity profile] alitalf.livejournal.com at 05:46pm on 11/11/2008
If the shrinkage is severe, and remains while the boiler is running, then indeed there could be low gas pressure, whether due to the tap not being fully on or any other reason. However, if it is temporary, just during the increase in flow, then my answer below remains more valid.

Either way, if the main burner gas flow is stopped with the pilot flame extinguished, then the capability for the building to fill with gas is limited, though there would be some risk in a small room with no ventillation. If the pilot flame gas supply is also stopped if the flame is extinguished, as is the case with all boilers I have seen, then there wuld not seem to be a means for this fault to cause danger as it stands.
 
posted by [identity profile] stephdairy.livejournal.com at 03:47pm on 11/11/2008
This all sounds like low gas pressure, which I had earlier this year. You should phone the National Grid Gas emergency line and they will send people round to fix it pronto.

(S)
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posted by [personal profile] emperor at 03:58pm on 11/11/2008
Gosh, is low gas pressure an emergency?
 
posted by [identity profile] stephdairy.livejournal.com at 04:01pm on 11/11/2008
So I was told, presumably because if the flame goes out unexpectedly due to insufficient pressure then your house fills with gas.

(S)
 
posted by [identity profile] mister-jack.livejournal.com at 04:15pm on 11/11/2008
Exactly.
 
posted by [identity profile] james-r.livejournal.com at 04:50pm on 11/11/2008
It sounds like it has a flame supervisor device anyway, so that shouldn't happen - it could partly be the flame supervisor being a little too twitchy.
 
posted by [identity profile] samholloway.livejournal.com at 04:21pm on 11/11/2008
I can believe this is the case. I had my gas meter replaced last week and, even though it's all outdoors, they insisted someone was home so that they could check the boiler fired again and the pressure was good.

Even if it's just the gas tap not fully on, it's still worth getting National Grid out to check, because they will come quickly owing to the possibility of boomage.
 
posted by [identity profile] yrieithydd.livejournal.com at 01:35pm on 12/11/2008
I had my gas meter replaced last week and, even though it's all outdoors, they insisted someone was home so that they could check the boiler fired again and the pressure was good.

I had mine done three weeks ago and I noticed that the letter said that they needed access to the house even if the meter was outside. I didn't follow up why on that as mine is inside. I made use of my retired father to housesit for the day.
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posted by [identity profile] alitalf.livejournal.com at 05:34pm on 11/11/2008
As I understand it, if the pilot flame is extinguished, then the gas to the main burner is stopped. Therefore at least one extra failure would be required in order to pose a significant risk. So, yes it would be good to have it repaired soon, but there appears to be no reason to panic.

If the jet for the pilot flame is accessible, it would be worth using a vacuum cleaner and a small brush to make sure it is thoroughly clean. I have seen detritus cause this sort of a problem.

Otherwise, a gas repairer is needed. Likely causes would be that the thermocouple (or whatever other gadget detects the presence of the flame) that has begun to fail, or the gas feed to the flame itself could be incorrect. Assuming that there is not a performance about having to go away and get the right part, a properly trained corgi should be able to solve the problem quickly.

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