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Did you not read? Vassal nation, sovereign state.

(How can you cede power to a non-foreign body? If it's not a foreign body, then you still have the power, because it hasn't gone outside you.)

S.

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The point is that government, any government, is a body that the people cede power to. Why is it so important that this body is based in London rather than Brussels? I don't think that a London-centric parliament is necessarily any more attuned to the needs of the Scotland, or even the Midlands. Describing pan-European politics as an attempt to forge vassal states is alarmist bunkum.

So, I assume you're a nominal supporter of the SNP, Plaid Cymru and Mebyon Kernow? Because to them, the British parliament is essentially a foreign body controlling their sovereign nations.

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London is the British parliament, so however out of touch it may be, it's not foreign. It's Britons governing Britain.

S.

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The Cornish, Scottish and Welsh might disagree with you there.

And 'imposing' rule from London on them is no different to 'imposing' rule on Britain from Brussels. It's a double-standard to say one is A-OK but the other is unacceptable.

So, what you're saying is, we shouldn't be subject to rule from Europe because we know better than them about our own affairs, but it's fine to subject Scotland, Wales, etc. to rule from England because we know better than them about their own affairs?

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Well said!

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How is Britain 'subjected' to rule from Britain?

S.

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How is Europe 'subjected' to rule from Europe?

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Like Churchill, I don't object to Europe being ruled from Europe.

S.

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Britain is part of Europe, just as Scotland is part of Britain.

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No, it isn't, and we've fought Philips, Napoleons and Hitlers to prove it.

S.

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You don't get to define geography and shared culture based on your own loopy prejudices.

So, because we were able to defeat the Welsh and the Scots, that gives us the right to rule them?

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How is Europe 'subjected' to rule from Europe?

Despite the fact that the Welsh are the original Britons, these days Britain is far too often synonymous with England and the concerns of Wales and Scotland are marginalised. Throughout the 1980s, Wales and Scotland were governed by the Tories who did not have a majority in their countries.

England just does not get the ways in which Wales is different from England and that is why devolution (and hopefully independence) is a good thing. However, there are things which are better dealt with at an international level, such as climate change, defence, immigration.

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The Welsh were conquered and haven't been a sovereign state for over a thousand years. They should just get over it.

If they wanted people to get the ways in which they were different they should have resisted conquest, like the Scots did.

S.

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We tried to resist conquest, but failed. However, we kept our language.

And why should nations that have been conquered deal with that when you think we should fight to keep our sovereignty.

You boast of the empire. I think that it was a regrettable thing because it took others sovereignty away.

I'm a nationalist, but a 'we're-equal-to-you-and-should-be-allowed-rule-ourselves' nationalist. Not a 'we're-better-than-you-and-should-rule-everyone-else' nationalist.

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You shouldn't have failed, then, is that I was saying.

We should fight to keep our sovereignty precisely so we don't have to deal with having been conquered -- whether conquered by force or conquered by willingly giving our sovereignty away.

And I'm not a nationalist of any variety. I'm a unionist.

S.

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But you're opposing a Union!

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I'm opposing abdicating power over this union, which is the one I'm for.

S.

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Apart from the Romans, the Danes, the Normans, etc. etc. ad nauseum ad infinitum.

'It's their own fault they got conquered'?

Jesus. Fucking. Christ.

People like you are the reason we can't have nice things. The fact that you can't see just how mind-numbingly racist (yes, the r-word) and incredibly stupid that sentiment is only confirms that your opinion is pretty much worthless.

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Since when were the Welsh a race?

S.

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The case for the prosecution rests, your honour.

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I hope you understand just how offensive your comment is.

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Yeah, but it's okay, 'cause they couldn't even hold off the English.

S.

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I wasn't just thinking of it being offensive to the Welsh, but to others.

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I hope not the Scots -- them I do respect.

S.

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In that case you might think a bit more carefully before putting finger to keyboard next time.

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