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posted by [personal profile] emperor at 12:29pm on 30/08/2011 under , ,
I enjoyed this episode of Doctor Who, although it was a bit of a shame that the 1930's Germany setting was little more than window-dressing. "Why didn't a time-traveller kill Hitler?" has been a bit of a sci-fi stable for ages, so having some time-travellers save Hitler's life was an amusing twist[0] (as was Hitler in the closet). It was a pacy episode, with some great comic moments, and River Song gets camper than ever. But.

I feel I have to reserve judgement on this series until we see how the plot arcs get wrapped up, but I'm beginning to worry about it. There's a bit too much of the ontological paradox (I mean, really, Melody Pond causes her parents to start going out, and then is named after herself?), and a bit too much deus ex machine (Mel is Amy and Rory's best friend, and this is the first we've heard of her?).

Also, whilst I really love River Song, I worry that they've not got a clear idea of how her life is plotted. This week's episode was a neat way of having her regenerating time-lordy skills resolved such that she can die in Silence in the Library, and also manages to explain why the Doctor has told her his real name (I assume that's what he says to her), but if she's part time-lord, why can she have time-lord-killing lipstick on without dying herself? And why does she, when she first meets her parents, not react as if she was meeting her parents?

So: this was fun, but I am concerned that after building up such a complicated mess of plot the ending will feel unsatisfactory, that the writers are going to pull another deus-ex-machine out of an ontological paradox to try and tidy things up. We shall see...

[0] Though having the trailers spoiler the "you just saved my life" line was a great shame. Why do that?
There are 19 comments on this entry. (Reply.)
 
posted by [identity profile] ptc24.livejournal.com at 11:33am on 30/08/2011
I have only seen occasional glimpses of the series, a question...

Hmmm, Melody Pond and River Song. Does this entirely obvious similarity have some in-universe explanation? Are we awaiting one?
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posted by [personal profile] emperor at 11:36am on 30/08/2011
Yes; see "A Good Man Goes To War", where this is explained.
 
posted by [identity profile] kerrypolka.livejournal.com at 11:37am on 30/08/2011
Yes, thoroughly and explicitly. Hurrah for (eventually) neat plotting.
 
posted by [identity profile] kerrypolka.livejournal.com at 11:40am on 30/08/2011
Yes, I really liked the character of River in the past 2.5 seasons, but I didn't get on with the way she was written in this one. I'm afraid she's going to be one of those characters like Captain Jack who was fab in small doses, but fell apart the more the show tried to explain them and shape plots around them.

Also, although the episode had much less Hitler than I was expecting, I think it was actually just the right amount of Hitler. "Shut up, Hitler" was tied with River and the Doctor's ludicrous flirtatious "aha, but I knew you'd know I knew" action hero banter for my favourite bit of the episode. :D
Edited Date: 2011-08-30 11:42 am (UTC)
 
posted by [identity profile] miramanga.livejournal.com at 11:57am on 30/08/2011
Loved this episode, very elegantly done indeed!
 
posted by [identity profile] timeplease.livejournal.com at 12:00pm on 30/08/2011
if she's part time-lord, why can she have time-lord-killing lipstick on without dying herself?
I was wondering about this! The best I can come up with is that she's still regenerating (she gets shot shortly afterwards and recovers immediately) so it doesn't affect her. Although that would mean that she was planning to regenerate anyway, and being shot by Hitler was just a lucky accident? Hmm.
 
posted by [identity profile] parrot-knight.livejournal.com at 12:03pm on 30/08/2011
All River's pharmaceutical lipsticks are presumably engineered in some way not to affect her, though how is not explained...
 
posted by [identity profile] rochvelleth.livejournal.com at 02:03pm on 30/08/2011
A layer of vaseline underneath? :)
 
posted by [identity profile] parrot-knight.livejournal.com at 12:11pm on 30/08/2011
I think that the idea of the Doctor saving Hitler was treated as a hook for the episode, setting up a problem which the episode sidelined as it was there to obscure the 'Birth of River Song' storyline.
 
posted by [identity profile] makyo.livejournal.com at 12:18pm on 30/08/2011
There's a bit too much of the ontological paradox (I mean, really, Melody Pond causes her parents to start going out, and then is named after herself?)
I don't have a major problem with this in small doses, or if handled in an entertaining way (like in the last episode of the previous series, where the reason the Doctor has a mop with him when he goes back in time to talk to talk to Rory is because future Rory has told him that he had a mop with him when he appeared).

Similarly ontological and ouroboric things happen to a particular character in Babylon 5. (Link contains spoilers for a 15-year-old episode of B5.)
 
posted by [identity profile] phlebas.livejournal.com at 12:46pm on 30/08/2011
I'm not sure it's a paradox this time, even - I think she went back and wrote herself in (as the cause of things which had originally happened without her intervention). Hence the best friend they'd never even mentioned to the Doctor, and so on.
 
posted by [identity profile] yrieithydd.livejournal.com at 12:31pm on 31/08/2011
Also, Amy's childhood got entirely rewritten at the end of last season when she remembered her parents who hadn't been there the first time around.
 
posted by [identity profile] sphyg.livejournal.com at 12:58pm on 30/08/2011
I thought this episode erred on tosh, though I've given up figuring out the timey-wimey stuff.
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posted by [personal profile] hooloovoo_42 at 01:19pm on 30/08/2011
I gave up after the last series and really CBA to care any more.

I tend to align somewhat with a lot of the comments in this interview.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2011/aug/19/the-coversation-doctor-who, particularly this bit

It seems to be doing its best to alienate the casual viewer and frustrate the faithful with its format of inter-crossing stories spilling over from one episode to the next – none of which seem to be resolved or adequately explained. Sure, it's convoluted and complicated, but in much the same way a toddler's scribbles can be. It's as if the creators can't trust the viewers to stay hooked through just quality, and instead keep them constantly dangling, desperately seeking answers for the ever-amassing pile of questions the show poses. It's like having a kid screaming, "I know something you don't know … but I'm not telling!" in your face non-stop for 45 minutes.
 
posted by [identity profile] shadowphiar.livejournal.com at 10:46pm on 30/08/2011
Did we even properly resolve *last season's* running plotline yet? What caused the Tardis to blow up?
 
posted by [identity profile] rochvelleth.livejournal.com at 02:04pm on 30/08/2011
I am concerned that after building up such a complicated mess of plot the ending will feel unsatisfactory, that the writers are going to pull another deus-ex-machine out of an ontological paradox to try and tidy things up.

Yes, I share this concern.
 
posted by (anonymous) at 10:26pm on 30/08/2011
I do not think you know what deus ex machina means.

Silence in the Library was a red herring: the machine would have killed the Doctor, too. Time Lords can be killed. Regneration saves them if they are badly injured, not if they are dead, and the machine in the Library was deadly.

The episode was rather unsatisfactory, but you've managed to miss miss why entirely by focussing on things like paradoxes and whether the plot will make sense. Do you think you might be suffering from being a geek?

S.
 
posted by [identity profile] jackfirecat.livejournal.com at 10:21pm on 31/08/2011
I was about to say that. Has he forgotten his own setting-up-ness? It was explicitly stated by River at the time that what he was about to do would have killed him, despite all his remaining regenerations. So, knowing later that she was a timelord too and also had regenerations to go (we presumed) made it more poignant not less or in need of explanation.

Ah, but, so, now she's saying that losing one, her last, regeneration is worth less than burning the doctor's several? That works too, but I may prefer the former intermediate.

And anyway at that time was she aware she was a timelord? She's bound to suffer some major memory loss sometime soon, otherwise she will have always known things she didn't know? Like she grew up in a spacesuit but when she first sees it she doesn't say, 'I grew up in suit much like this... wait, this is it.' or 'mummy, why did you at shoot me?'

 
posted by (anonymous) at 01:38pm on 09/09/2011
I'm guessing that the excess regenerative energy donated by River Song will be key to him jump-starting a new regenerative cycle as part of his revival after being shot by the astronaut.

S.

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